Will trueSpace return under another name?

[moogaloonie]

I read somewhere that tS development has continued beyond the last available version, and that it is simply just no longer being called trueSpace. Is it possible that tS could return in the future as a re-named, re-branded product aimed at a different market?

[froo]

Hey now that'd be interesting.
Do you have a link moogaloonie?

[First Light]

I read somewhere that tS development has continued beyond the last available version, and that it is simply just no longer being called trueSpace. Is it possible that tS could return in the future as a re-named, re-branded product aimed at a different market?

Hi moogaloonie,

"I read somewhere" is pretty thin. If you can remember where you read this AND if it was a credible source then it would be very interesting as froo wrote. Otherwise, it's probably just a rumor with no basis in reality.

Best regards, First Light

[theuns]

probably won't because the source has not been released... what is happening is that developers and plug-in writer are continuing to change and add things as much as they can without access to the core engine...

what would be great is if the community could BUY the source from MS and make it into a new opensource program, like they did with Blender...

i wonder how many tS users would be keen go for something like this?

[froo]

You mean how many ts users would want to actually modify the source code?
Quite honestly, from the looks of it:

0


Buying the source code and making changes to it sounds really nice on paper but when it comes to
putting in the effort, it appears no one would be motivated to do it. Making plugins is actually easier
than modifying the source code. And there is virtually no one making Workspace plugins. I do not know of any
currently in progress. So, if there is no plugin development activity, what makes us think there will
be a coordinated effort to update the truespace source code if it were to be purchased?

I could be wrong but I seriously doubt it. I am not being negative, just making an observation.

EDIT:
I drifted off topic. I would still be interested in seeing a link.

[First Light]

... like they did with Blender...

Hi theuns,

I could be wrong, but as I understand it, the original creator of Blender raised the capital to buy the program back from the public company that had purchased it when they purchased his orignal company. The trueSpace equivalent would be for Roman Ormandy to raise the capital to buy back the trueSpace code from Microsoft.

The notion that the Blender transition to open-source was a community-led inititiative is false (as far as I can tell). Again, it appears to have been led and controlled by the original creator of the program---someone with intimate knowledge of the source code. Sadly it appears that froo is right about there being insufficient interest in the trueSpace community (or at least by individuals with the necessary expertise) to even consider an attempt to acquire the trueSpace code.

I hope that I'm wrong. I wish that our developers would band together and, possibly under the leadership of v3rd3, gain control of the source code for future development. But that's a "fantasy" right now.

Best regards, First Light

[Finis]

The rumor that Moogaloonie read, if based on anything, is probably about the plugin development by Froo and such. It is possible that MS still has plans for TS or whatever technology within it that MS wanted so the rumor could have come from there.

MS is very unlikely to sell the code for TS to anyone. If they would it is very unlikely that any TS'er group could raise as much as it would surely cost. Asking them to release the code is worthless. You have to offer them a good deal.

TS doesn't have any competitive edge to make it worth continued development except possibly for MS if market conditions are ever favorable again since they have Roman and the resources to finish and modernize the program if they choose.

Even if the code could be acquired, as First Light noted, the people purchasing Blender's code were the one's that developed it. Without that TS would be even more obsolete by the time the new owners even learned the code. Where is the experience in developing this kind of program? Sure Froo and everyone making plugins know what the are doing but where is a whole team of people with all the knowledge and skills necessary to succeed in such a project? Where is the motivation for them to do it with little or no pay? Why would TS be the place for such a team to start?

I like TS too but I don't see why there is this devotion to it and wish to continue development when there are plenty of other programs out there and current TS users can probably continue to use what we have for a long time.

[moogaloonie]

First thing, where are you finding a quote button?

OK, about where I read that. It was in another forum, and I'll give you a clue. It's a forum for another 3D program that began life on the Amiga. I will try to find the post, but finding the forum itself was an effort. I didn't immediately recognise the poster by name and so I'm treating it as hearsay. Did seem credible though, and gave the impression that while it was essentially a version of trueSpace beyond 7.61, it may not have had the full toolset and could perhaps be part of another program entirely. Will keep looking.

As for blender, yes, Ton Roosendaal did lead the effort to buy it back. Despite being an original author though, I think it still stands as a community effort. He was acting as a user and fan, albeit of something he himself had started. They raised the money in a fairly short time, IIRC.

I thought XNA would have been a good home for trueSpace. The DX9 nature of the workspace would allow for good approximations of shaded models in game use, and it'd be nice to have the import/export formats of gameSpace back. It could have been the standard tool for the XNA community and might speed development in the way that good standardised tools often can. The more I thought about it, the more I wondered if someone such as Autodesk hadn't persuaded Microsoft to kill trueSpace.

OSS trueSpace would likely stall, as the DX9 codebase would necessitate Windows development until the code could be moved to OpenGL, a huge undertaking I would assume.

[Benji]

I could be wrong, but as I understand it, the original creator of Blender raised the capital to buy the program back from the public company that had purchased it when they purchased his orignal company. The trueSpace equivalent would be for Roman Ormandy to raise the capital to buy back the trueSpace code from Microsoft.

This is true. However you should remember that Blender had two major advantages over workspace: 1) It was never owned by MS and, 2) It was already well-liked and worked proprerly.

The sad thing is that you would proabably see a lot of interest, among current and older users alike, to resurrect 6.6 and modernise it. Maybe not Blender interest, but imo a lot more than most open-source apps, especially if you include the nostalgia vote from "this was my first 3d app" ex-users, of which there are many.

I really don't buy the rumour of workspace coming out under a different name. Of course, I could be wrong, some people really don't learn from their mistakes.............

[moogaloonie]

I would still prefer to have Workspace with the rest of the tools moved over than an updated Model side. Everyone who thinks Caligari was crazy for starting over with Rosetta architecture should take a look at NewTek. They are about to do almost the same thing with LightWave.

http://www.newtek.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95480" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Sometimes you really do have to go back to move ahead.